problems with certain helpers

[Beatlefan6]

So lately some friends and I have been problems with helpers (mainly leosbiggestfan). Some of them are really great for example Kaat and Emi (can't remember full ign) but some of the others helpers don't give warnings and mute people on the spot. I made this thread for everyone to help support a higher age restriction for helper, banning of abusive helpers, and teaching to improve said helper for the future. So please consider taking a screenshot and placing your evidence down here and hopefully this thread will grow so that the owner (_nickk) and other helpers will improve the server.

 

[KyronicGaming]

Perhaps We should identity a specific problem here and work on that instead of trying to punish those because of a opinion, If this was 2 weeks ago, Id be the first to say that the staff team are corrupt and simply do not care about us with some exceptions, All members of the staff team are different and handle things according to there point of view and stance on the situation at hand, This sometimes causes issues because other staff members might disagree and although that might seem to be a bad thing, Its great in fact. It gets people talking about certain issues that if resolved could benefit the server massively, A example of this was my Ban around a month ago, It was very clear that between that staff team everyone had different views about what is right and what is not, My ban had gotten the staff talking and now the rules have been updated and it benefits the server and the players that play on it. It created a more fair system regarding mini-maps and some other rules. In 11 days I return to the server and I want to help people with issues that people might have, If you want I can help you with some issues but I want to do it without getting in the way of the staff team. I am very formal in the way I type and display my point of view without being biased and looking at both sides of the argument while suggesting what could happen in the future, If you want I can help you portray your current feelings so that it is looked apon more seriously so that it has more of a impact. If you truly want change you need to get people talking, respectfully providing a logical argument with proof without slandering a specific staff member is your best chance at making change happen. I think people forget that staff members are human too and they provide a great service to us, although sometimes I don't agree with some of there point of views, They are humans and humans make mistakes. I have spoken to over half the staff team verbally and a good portion over messages over Discord,Skype and Team-speak and they are great individuals just trying to do right. We all want the same thing, a pleasant experience, Lets work together to achieve that.
- Kyritic

 

[Beatlefan6]

I understand what your saying as if they have issues but I been seeing the same problems with warnings in shout plus could be a scenario where helpers abusing there powers. Like for instance (keep in mind this happened a while back probably while you were banned) there was a helper who muted people for no reason or evidence because her friends told her to do. She did eventually get banned as helper but it still possible it could happen. Not saying helpers are the worse/best thing on earth but they are human we all make restates and some can be repetitive. This is why I made this thread to show certain mistakes helpers have made and where they can improve on. If you have any other questions or clarifications I'll awnser them
-Beatle

 

[KyronicGaming]

I cannot really make a destions about what you should do, That is the staff teams role but I can give you my opinion. I can understand why you wouldn't want this to be a private thing, You want it to be public so that others can give there experiences in and so that you can you can get others involved, It can also create more of a impact. But there the issue of publicly humiliating a member of staff because of simple basic mistake that should not be held against them, It most likely will do the opposite effect of what your trying to achieve, I personaly would take it to one of the staff members like Kat but I understand why you would not want to, So here's what I'm going to say. If you deem it necessary to make this public, perhaps inforce a rule stating that the specific staff member name should either be blurred out or not mention. I have many staff members I can contact for you if you would like. Thank you for being respectful during your reply and I hope your issues get to what you deem resolved. - Kyritic

 

[3sw]

So lately some friends and I have been problems with helpers (mainly leosbiggestfan). Some of them are really great for example Kaat and Emi (can't remember full ign) but some of the others helpers don't give warnings and mute people on the spot. I made this thread for everyone to help support a higher age restriction for helper, banning of abusive helpers, and teaching to improve said helper for the future. So please consider taking a screenshot and placing your evidence down here and hopefully this thread will grow so that the owner (_nickk) and other helpers will improve the server.

The Helpers aren't doing their job wrong, in fact, they're doing it right. The rules are simply enforced, and the according punishment is given for violating such rule, of course some staff would rather not immediately punish, but rather tell the rule-breaker not to do it again, instead of writing a warning up as a punishment. It all comes down to the discretion of the staff members themselves, an example of abusing would be muting someone for Filter Bypass is they haven't received a warning yet from the staff member, as the rules clearly say that first it's a warning, then followed by a one hour mute. If someone didn't give that warning in the first place, then it would classify as abuse. And the staff not giving you a warning straight away is simply them cutting you a break, and giving you another chance before it's a warning. Not all staff have this approach, and giving a warning straight away would not be abuse, because the rules clearly say that the first offense vouches for a warning. Now, some staff may warn straight away as per to their discretion, since the punishment is up to them, however giving an incorrect/severe punishment for a minor would be abuse.

Think of it as in real life, the police wouldn't arrest you straight away for littering, since it's a minor and nothing near a felony. They may however write you a ticket, but that's up to them (the same applies in bypassing filter, they could either tell you to stop, or warn you). Arresting you for committing a minor is simply abuse of authority (muting you for bypassing the filter once is obviously abuse), since the crime does not require such procedure. However littering again, simply tells the police that you haven't learnt your lesson, to not do it again. If they wrote you a ticket before, you may have an even more expensive ticket, or community service. But if they didn't write you a ticket, you would get one now. The severity of the littering and the punishment for doing so, is all up to the officers discretion. The job of a police officer is to enforce the law, if you haven't learnt your lesson the first time, the police will take more drastic measures the second time.

I hope this makes sense, it's all up to the staff if they want to cut you a break or not. And they most likely won't if you break a rule severely. For example, simply bypassing the filter by saying something inappropriate, such as cussing may simply result in the staff telling you to stop. However, bypassing the filter by saying racist slurs, or discriminating others, may vouch you for an instant warning without a second chance.

 

[Beatlefan6]

The Helpers aren't doing their job wrong, in fact, they're doing it right. The rules are simply enforced, and the according punishment is given for violating such rule, of course some staff would rather not immediately punish, but rather tell the rule-breaker not to do it again, instead of writing a warning up as a punishment. It all comes down to the discretion of the staff members themselves, an example of abusing would be muting someone for Filter Bypass is they haven't received a warning yet from the staff member, as the rules clearly say that first it's a warning, then followed by a one hour mute. If someone didn't give that warning in the first place, then it would classify as abuse. And the staff not giving you a warning straight away is simply them cutting you a break, and giving you another chance before it's a warning. Not all staff have this approach, and giving a warning straight away would not be abuse, because the rules clearly say that the first offense vouches for a warning. Now, some staff may warn straight away as per to their discretion, since the punishment is up to them, however giving an incorrect/severe punishment for a minor would be abuse.

Think of it as in real life, the police wouldn't arrest you straight away for littering, since it's a minor and nothing near a felony. They may however write you a ticket, but that's up to them (the same applies in bypassing filter, they could either tell you to stop, or warn you). Arresting you for committing a minor is simply abuse of authority (muting you for bypassing the filter once is obviously abuse), since the crime does not require such procedure. However littering again, simply tells the police that you haven't learnt your lesson, to not do it again. If they wrote you a ticket before, you may have an even more expensive ticket, or community service. But if they didn't write you a ticket, you would get one now. The severity of the littering and the punishment for doing so, is all up to the officers discretion. The job of a police officer is to enforce the law, if you haven't learnt your lesson the first time, the police will take more drastic measures the second time.

I hope this makes sense, it's all up to the staff if they want to cut you a break or not. And they most likely won't if you break a rule severely. For example, simply bypassing the filter by saying something inappropriate, such as cussing may simply result in the staff telling you to stop. However, bypassing the filter by saying racist slurs, or discriminating others, may vouch you for an instant warning without a second chance.

yeah I understand what you mean but there are some helpers that don't warn at all and immediately mute them without any warning. its a different story if the person doing the problem repeatedly and getting warned then eventually muted to a person who is immediately muted. mainly because there are different situations of what, who or why he said that but there is a rare case when the staff can be abusive one instance that I have said earlier in this thread. I'm not saying that person who did it didn't deserve it but if the helpers keep repeating not warning someone for what they said or what they done then it could be a problem that needs to be noticed.
-Beatle

 

[3sw]

yeah I understand what you mean but there are some helpers that don't warn at all and immediately mute them without any warning. its a different story if the person doing the problem repeatedly and getting warned then eventually muted to a person who is immediately muted. mainly because there are different situations of what, who or why he said that but there is a rare case when the staff can be abusive one instance that I have said earlier in this thread. I'm not saying that person who did it didn't deserve it but if the helpers keep repeating not warning someone for what they said or what they done then it could be a problem that needs to be noticed.
-Beatle

Well, to that I say that different rules have different punishment guidelines that have to be followed. For example, for inappropriate chat you are meant to be muted without warning, but what if your filter bypass is linked with inappropriate chat, and you break both rules? You get muted without warning for both, but you might think it's just one of them. There are also rare cases like you said, where staff do mute for rules that only vouch for a warning, but this is usually because the punishment does not equal the severity of the rules broken. If I were staff, and I saw someone bypassing filter by saying racist words, in attempt to insult someone, I'd most likely instantly mute without warning, especially if the player has had a history of using racist language and arguing.

 

[GiveMeWafflezz]

If you think you get muted unfairly you can always take a screenshot and report it in a support ticket, also in teamspeak as staff will come to staff help room. If you also think a staff member is abusing you are more than welcome to make a support ticket @ www.havocmc.net/support and you will get a reply but make sure you have evidence. I would like to say that staff are working extremely hard on things and sometimes makes mistakes but who doesn't make mistakes its part of like to learn and move on.

If you have any other questions feel free to message me on the forums or if you see me in game and i will happily help to my best ability.


-Saint_Ash

 

[Wavy_Buster]

Time to settle this.

1) The Helpers are probably doing their jobs, you cannot see if they have punished a player as it does not show up in normal chat.
2) If you have solid evidence/screenshots of this happening, please upload the images to imgur.com and private message me on the forums.

Thanks,
Wavy

 

[UnknownMelody]

By the looks of the last two posts, we're going up in ranks in response to this thread so I guess it's time for my response. c:

Most of the time when players report staff members for being abusive or not doing their job, they are incorrect in their claims. For example, people claim that a staff member doesn't punish other players but they punish you. It may seem this way, but like Wavy said - other player's punishments are not broadcasted in chat. However, there are some situations when there actually is a staff member abusing or not doing their job correctly. This is when we need evidence or otherwise it's just hearsay. Of course, we take all concerns seriously and do watch players and staff members if they have been reported but this is not as effective as actual evidence from players experiencing blatant abuse. If you have any evidence, please submit it in a report or send it to me privately and I will personally make sure that the situation is dealt with accordingly. If you don't, there isn't anything we can do. Just like we cannot punish players without evidence, we cannot punish staff members without evidence. We are always open and welcoming of new evidence that will help us improve our staff team, so please don't think I'm simply disregarding this post. I just want to make it as clear as possible - if you don't have evidence, we can't directly help you. We can watch any reported staff members, but there's no guarantee that we will catch them doing anything wrong. I strongly suggest taking screenshots whenever you receive a punishment that you believe it is incorrect, but please make sure that you also include the message that you are receiving the punishment for as well. Nevertheless, thank you for bringing this topic to our attention. c:

 

[Cactiee]

sometimes.... /ignore add works...